Re: Star Wars Episode VII Discussion ***SPOILERS***
Posted: January 4th, 2016, 12:41 pm
ptdebate wrote: Scotland-- with all due respect, neither you nor anyone else has ever called a male character a "Mary Sue." For that reason alone, it is a ridiculous appellation.
Let's disavow you of the notion this is one sided and sexist. Here are male Mary Sues (or Marty Stus) in groups. Enter Captain Picard, Jonny Quest, the Lone Ranger, the Silver Age Superman, Wolverine and others who are just too darn good.
Family One - Begins as a Marty Stu, but flaws show up later - James Bond in Dr. No, Captain Kirk in "Where no man has gone before" and Harry Potter in Philosopher's Stone.
Family Two - Begins as a Marty Stu but audience knows meta information about their flaws (because its a prequel, or how the story goes is common knowledge) - Little Ani in The Phantom Menace, Lancelot in the Arthurian Legends, Samson in the bible, Hercules or Achilles in Greek legend.
Family Three - Begins more well rounded but becomes a Marty Stu later - Wolverine, Captain Picard. (This is a constant issue in long running series, both for heroes and villains - why do you think Gwen Stacy died, after all).
Family Four - Written to be a Marty Stu or Paragon as an Ideal of the time - The Lone Ranger, Gene Autry, the George Reeves Superman, all the 1960s Justice League of America heroes in the comics. Adam Strange, Tarzan, Lord of the Apes, Doc Savage, Man of Bronze. Dick Tracy.Buck Rogers, Flash Gordon, Wesley Crusher Boy Genius et al. Time may tarnish them as values change, but they were intended to be ideals to look up to. Special shoutout to Saturday Morning Cartoons geared directly to kids, such as the Superfriends, Herculoids, Jonny Quest, Will Robinson, Spaaaaace Ghoooooost, and more.
So there you go. A big ol list of about 20 Marty Stus.
Its all about balance. Maybe Rey will have an interesting backstory to explain it all (and the name 'Rey' hints at a regal family connection doesn't it, which could mean a connection to Leia). Maybe TFA will be her shining hour, and the next movie really push her to the breaking point - maybe so she is the one that has to leave a child behind forever. That would be better storytelling - but we don't have that information yet.
Why is her being a Mary Sue a weakness in the story? Because there are only a few types of conflict, one being "Person vs Self", in other words, personal growth. Sure, you can tell exciting stories with "Vs Other Person", "Vs Society" and "Vs Nature" , but "Vs Self" is really where the emotional investment is. Without that, it may as well be a Jason of Star Command on Saturday Mornings on CBS.