Dead PS3 part 2

General and high profile video game topics.
Oltobaz1
Posts: 1605
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

Dead PS3 part 2

Postby Oltobaz1 » May 17th, 2012, 2:39 pm

This cloud feature is interesting, I ultimately decided against subscribing to
Playstation Plus mainly because I'm fine with a regular free PSN, still, I would
probably have subscribed, had the transfer data option not been available. 

Suplexmachine1
Posts: 88
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

Dead PS3 part 2

Postby Suplexmachine1 » May 17th, 2012, 4:36 pm

My 80gb BC PS3 died...but not because of the YLOD.  It was actually the GPU that went out!  I sent it to Sony but they couldn't repair it (or so they say), so they sent me a refurbished 80gb BC PS3 to take its place.  Has been running beautifully for years now.  I'm still scared that it'll die on me again, which makes me kinda want to sell it on eBay (people are always looking for BC PS3's) and just get a Slim.

Irenicus1
Posts: 421
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

Dead PS3 part 2

Postby Irenicus1 » May 18th, 2012, 11:01 am

I'm on my 4th PS2. Two fat & 2 slim. My 360 rrod two months before my warranty expired. Microsoft fixed it for me. I really want to get a PS3, but I don't like how this all sounds.


Oltobaz1
Posts: 1605
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

Dead PS3 part 2

Postby Oltobaz1 » May 18th, 2012, 11:08 am

I feel Microsoft handled this mess professionally, when I don't think Sony
even acknowledged the problem. I could be wrong on that though, still, it's a
fact Microsoft took some genuine steps, when Sony did not. This makes them
looking even worse than Microsoft, it really is a disgrace. 

Rev1
Posts: 1777
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

Dead PS3 part 2

Postby Rev1 » May 18th, 2012, 12:55 pm

It honestly sounds like just bad luck to me. i think this generation has just been full of consoles that break a lot. I'm still on my first of everything and haven't had too bad of luck other then one of my games getting stuck in my PS3. My friend uses his PS3 like a full time job and had to replace his console this year after downloading some sort of virus onto his PS3 (or maybe it was just time to kick the bucket).

The only real point I have to contribute to this though is that consoles today do a lot more today then they did 25 years ago. Even 10 years ago. The PS3 and 360 are pushed as multi-media consoles, able to do all sorts of things, yet they are also much cheaper then buying all the individual items separately (PS3 being able to play PS1, PS2, blue ray player, PS3 player, extra hard drive, etc), which is this a bad thing? No not really. This was one of the main reasons the PS2 was able to sell so many consoles while DVD players were still considered expensive. It offered a cheap alternative to buying a DVD player, while at the same time doing other things. At the same time, you get what you pay for and years later it is apparent that the dvd players on the PS2 were seriously lacking in quality. The same can be said for the current generation consoles' extra options. For every disc that you play on your console, you are slowly wearing it down. Electronics are just that way. Some products have a much longer life line then others of the same product. Not all consoles are built equally as much as we would like to believe it.

Still, there are many reasons why my SNES still works 20 years later, when compared to my original PS2, which I used for gaming, and everything else. It only had to focus on doing 1 thing- playing games. Which my PS2 didn't have that luxury. That's just how things are going to go as more consoles try to do far more then simple gaming. Plus, games that played cartridge games, usually had far less moving parts, then the current consoles, which gives them less opportunity to screw up. If you keep your games clean, your system clean, etc, you are likely to not destroy your retro system for a very long time.

Also, why should Sony have to offer an extended warranty for people who got amazing use out of their consoles? Do car companies do this? "Oh, you've only had your car for 3 years, but you drove it 150,000 miles. Hmmm... okay, sure we'll replace it." No way, companies don't do that. Not everyone who buys a product is going to put their item through as much wear and tear as another person. Would you? Of course not. Microsoft had to offer some sort of extended warranty for their products because more then a few percent of their xbox's were kicking the bucket. I can't even tell you the exact number of 360's came through Nebraska Furniture Mart (worked their too, had a huge game section) to get a replacement with their extended warranty (that they had to purchase on the side at the time of sale, this was before Microsoft even was basically forced to offer a 3 year warranty for the RROD or face major lawsuits). If they wouldn't have had their extended warranty they would have been screwed. No other way around it. I probably did less then 5 PS3s over the 4 years I was in customer service, and we did close to 10-15 a week on 360's (multiply that by 52 weeks and then by 4 years). It was too the point the extended warranty company didn't even question what was wrong with the 360, they just replaced the thing. Sure Microsoft eventually offered an extended-extended warranty for their product but it was only because they would have had to after so many systems simply dying.

The fact of the matter is that consoles get far more use today then they did 20 years ago. Sure you may have played titles over and over again on your SNES, but you also can now say "I'd rather play online" and then spend almost all your time online playing your games. Or you can say "I want to watch a movie", and pop in a dvd or blue ray. "I'd rather browse the web" and then do that. The more you use your console for other things, the more likely it's going to die. If you drive all day long, every day, you are going to either A.) have to get it serviced a lot, or B.) get a new car in 2-3 years. That's just how things work, I doubt it is going to get any better as consoles try and do more and more. Also, some people just get unlucky, and go through countless problems when the majority of games simply never go through another console. It sucks, but it happens. It's not really Sony's fault that you got to crappy PS3s when millions of other users are simply on their first console and it is working perfectly. 

Oltobaz1
Posts: 1605
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

Dead PS3 part 2

Postby Oltobaz1 » May 18th, 2012, 2:42 pm

This is interesting. I'd like to throw in a few comments:

1/ I'm sure you didn't get as many broken PS3 as you got 360.
Then again, general consensus is that the PS3 is, at least a little,
more reliable. Also, it did come out later, though it hardly makes
any difference today. If it's any indication, there were just as many
dead PS3 as 360 at the parisian repair console shop I went to the other day.
Sony is apparently saying this isn't accurate, but if independant repair shops
are to be trusted, a LOT of PS3 are going through repairs.

2/ I see the logic behind your car industry analogy, I also see how it's flawed.
You see, nobody really know why some systems go through YLOD when some
don't. According to a BBC study, "console mileage" don't seem to play an important part, if at all. Consider systems running all day long for demo purpose
in stores, and you'll know what I mean.

3/ I find it's hard to accept SONY will only replace the console, not repair it.
Oh that's right, those don't even last. Unbelievable.

4/ Yes, the PS2 was faulty as well, though the problem was less concerning to this gamer (no data loss).  Still, there are other CD based systems that are known to be faulty, and they weren't designed as media centers. The Mega CD. The PC Engine DUO. The original Playstation, the Dreamcast... And, at the same time, reliable products like the Saturn, the Gamecube, the first X BOX... They're not created equals, indeed, which is why we're entitled to say some exhibit better reliability. Systems are definitely more complex than before, yet the Wii doesn't seem to encounter that many issues.

5/ let's just consider Viper82 story. Don't you think SONY is liable for three dead systems in less than a year? It's not even an isolated example. Not saying that luck doesn't play its part, but it can't be the only factor here.

Rev1
Posts: 1777
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

Dead PS3 part 2

Postby Rev1 » May 18th, 2012, 4:26 pm

1.) Increased use leads to an increased # of defective products becoming apparent. This is an obvious fact for any consumer product that one might buy. So yes, as the 360 and PS3 have both seemed to reach their stride this generation more gamers are putting their consoles through equally proportional use. What I saw 3 years ago when I was working customer service has probably shifted somewhat due to both consoles now having many more solid titles and many more consoles sold. Gamers have more incentive then ever to buy and play their PS3s or 360s since there are now so many "solid" titles for their games.

I'm sure the repair shop has probably an equal number of consoles in stock at a time, although it probably gets more 360's through the door. Also, using repair shops as your only source is unreliable. There are also many fully functioning 360's that destroy their games, do those count? Honestly, I'm not sure but it is something to take into consideration.

There are several articles and studies done over the overall failure rate of the 360, most studies seem to confirm that the 360 still has nearly twice the failure rate (in some form or another) over its competitors, yes even the current ones. Has the 360 improved? Yes, but it still beats the Wii and PS3 combined, statistically. So should Microsoft have a more lenient warranty? Most definitely. It also has a bad rap with consumers, even though the console has improved dramatically. So Microsoft has put itself in this position, they HAVE to offer a better warranty because most consumers simply don't TRUST the company since the console is so well known for system failures. The PS3 and Wii have never put themselves in this position thus they really don't need a bigger warranty to sell their products.

2. As I said before, not all consoles are built equally. It's a sad truth with any item that you buy. All I meant was that the more it was used the more likely it was to become apparent that your console will fry. Some people get horrible luck and everything goes wrong multiple times, many don't ever see a problem. Still, the people who use their console for everything are far more likely to see a problem when compared to the people who take breaks between long stretches of gaming, don't game as much, etc. The car example was more in regards to their warranty system then an actual car. Cars always offer a warranty like "10 years or 100,000 miles" whichever is hit first. Obviously some people use their stuff more often then others, doesn't mean that it will break. Also a console will go through much more work being played at someones house 20-40 hours a week compared to being simply ON at a store. Still I agree with you on this, but all I am saying is that if there is going to be a problem, the more you use it in vastly different ways, the more likely you are to run into a problem. Most of the consoles at game stores are played very little, and are mostly used for demos. That's a big difference when compared to all the real play it gets at someone's home.

3. I agree with you there, it sucks. But that is just how it is. Microsoft has built its own reputation for sucking the big one when it comes to console durability, Sony hasn't. Still Sony has had problems with their own consoles, in regards to their Sony Network due to being hacked. Many consumers do not view the console as safe for online play/purchases. Sony has tried to address this by offering free downloads for consumers and striving to improve the security of their network, but they still have lost tons of money and faith from the consumers. Still, both consoles seem to try to fix the big problems in the eyes of the consumer. Sadly, failure rate is a deemed as a bigger problem for Microsoft then it is for Sony, thus Microsoft has a better system for repairing consoles.

4. Totally agree with you there. All consoles aren't built equally. Cold hard fact. Some companies go through a lot more means to make their consoles durable, while others seem to miss at every conceivable mark. Still, most of the companies with more durable consoles seem to have more experience in the matter. The NGC and original XBOX both came after the PS2, and had more time to build a better product. The Saturn same after the MegaCD and TurboDuo, thus Sega already had experience on the matter (the dreamcast still had to compete with the PS1 and N64 so was likely rushed out to get a head start on the other consoles of the 6th Generation, plus the technology was changing at the time as all the new consoles were changing format). The MegaCD and TurboDuo where two of the first CD based consoles in the US, thus weren't built that wonderfully. Then you have the Jaguar CD, 3D0 and the CD-i, which kind of aren't that reliable at all anyway. Anyway, the point I'm trying to make is that the ones that seem more reliable
"usually" had a better understanding of what they were working with. The 360 and the PS3 are also using newer technology, while the Wii is basically a last generation console with motion controls. Of course Nintendo got it right, all the kinks had already been worked out for half a dozen years or so.

5. I agree with you there, luck is definitely not the only part. Since both consoles have seem to hit their stride in this generation, I'm sure many more consoles will come up defective. The more people start using their consoles the more the defective ones will pop up. We will know in a couple years or so what the true statistics are for broken consoles, since people will be using their consoles more this year then any previous year (except for probably the Wii, which might as well be considered having 1 foot in the grave already, with the Wii U's announcement and lack of major releases for the console). If Sony's problem gets bad and their console develops a reputation for sucking they will have to change their warranty system or do something more. Still, they don't have to do anything at this point because universally it isn't considered a big enough problem (yet?). Electronics break and go bad, it happens. How big of a problem is it? We'll know soon enough. I doubt it will stop Sony from selling a ton more consoles though.

Oltobaz1
Posts: 1605
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

Dead PS3 part 2

Postby Oltobaz1 » May 18th, 2012, 5:26 pm

I do think their attitude towards the issue is part of their business strategy.
If they acknowledged the problem like Microsoft did, it would then become
even more significant. That's probably what they think, and they were probably
right, from a cynical standpoint, at least at the beginning. But people who went through their pathetic customer service like I did would beg to differ, Sony, as a
brand can now be associated with cynic strategies and unreliability. Me, I'll buy
the PS4, but I'm hardly rational when it comes to video games. The fact of the matter is, they actually lost some customers along the way. Risky strategy, or acceptable losses , depends how you look at things I guess, still a disgrace, I say.

Repair shops is one reliable way to fully grasp what's going on out there. There aren't that many, but who's better qualified in this instance than the people who actually deal with the stuff? But you know, my primary source, beyond that, my
own friends and what anyone can find on the internet, ultimately lies within my
own experience. Three systems. In five years. That's not normal.

I fully agree with you, the Wii being underpowered, things are less demanding, hence it's more durable, yet, you can use it to play games, watch movies, surf the
internet... And it holds up fine. I'm gonna be honest with you, I don't think the media center capabilities of the PS3/360 or any other consoles are to be blamed here. You'll just have to trust me of course, but, like I said earlier, I didn't use any CD/DVD with my second system, I hardly even surfed the internet. I did watch Blu Rays, played games, and that's pretty much it. I used it like a console, basically. I never did anything as demanding as leaving it on 8 hours straight six days a week. Now,that is demanding. Yet it died. Because it's poorly designed. You can't even repair it! 

That's the issue I have with Sony, though I intend to keep buying their products,
they're not taking responsability. Simple as that. The YLOD problem is huge, though a bit overshadowed by Microsoft's RROD, but they're not willing to extend their warranty, they're not willing to compensate their customers in any way. They should have taken Microsoft's stance on things, if only to be spared the bad publicity. They lost a lot of customers this gen due in part to bad marketing decisions, this is one of those. You just don't "expletive" with your customers.


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