Can a game suck no matter how technically well-made it is?

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astrodomekid
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Can a game suck no matter how technically well-made it is?

Postby astrodomekid » February 10th, 2017, 10:09 pm

When I posted my "My idea for a Sonic comeback" topic back in November, I stated that Sega should try something darker and more serious. And I still stand by this belief. Granted, this idea sounds bad on paper; but I believe that a stronger storyline with more complex character development could in one way or another make a great Sonic game as long as it doesn't go too far. And I brought all this up in hopes that it would inspire a brighter future for my favorite franchise. And while we all know the early Sonic games are legendary, I feel it's time to find a new way of looking at this story that has been told thousands of times in the exact same way. Franchises like Batman and TMNT already have multiple variations that are unique in their own way while still staying true to what originally made them so great, and I think Sonic is no different in this aspect. While the games seem to take center stage in what most people think of when they think of Sonic, there's also other variations like the comic books, multiple TV series, and more. So I think a darker version could still work as long as it's done right.

Still, the replies I got on that post strongly disagreed with me, claiming that a darker version simply couldn't work. And this brings me back to a question that I have been asking to myself for a long time now: can a game do everything in its power to be good yet have a concept or other minor detail so stupid that all the effort in the world couldn't possibly redeem it? And if so, what would be an example of this?

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Stalvern
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Re: Can a game suck no matter how technically well-made it is?

Postby Stalvern » February 11th, 2017, 6:28 am

In your original thread, I asked, "Which one is going to start this comeback, making it dark or making it good?" A game isn't a TV show; the premise of the story has very little to do with the quality of the actual game. Sonic '06 was a horrible game with a dark and serious tone, but the lighthearted Rise of Lyric was almost equally awful. At the same time, F-Zero GX has an inhumanly stupid "story" but is one of the greatest racing games ever (regardless of the Critic's review). And then you have Another World, which has an excellent story but is barely a game at all - follow the script perfectly or die. The assumptions of your question are fundamentally misguided.

Besides, I would also argue that this dark, serious story literally can't be told with the Sonic characters. The games have spent decades establishing them as goofy stereotypes; even if Sega managed to find the right people to put this together, they'd still be faced with the Sisyphean task of delivering it through twerps like Tails and Amy Rose. This game could have the script from Chinatown, but the moment a character opened their mouth to let out one of those voices, it'd be all over.

To make this post more fun (if less relevant to your ideas about Sonic), I'll single out Risky Woods as a game killed by a "minor detail so stupid that all the effort in the world couldn't possibly redeem it", for showering coins and items across the screen but making you stop and kneel down to pick them up one at a time. The icing on the cake is that many of the items do horrible things anyway, like flipping the screen upside-down or putting your character to sleep. What tremendous spite.

Voor
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Re: Can a game suck no matter how technically well-made it is?

Postby Voor » February 11th, 2017, 12:50 pm

Sure. Lots of games do things right, but just have no soul. This is especially true of some sequels.

pacman000
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Re: Can a game suck no matter how technically well-made it is?

Postby pacman000 » February 11th, 2017, 2:27 pm

Still, the replies I got on that post strongly disagreed with me, claiming that a darker version simply couldn't work. And this brings me back to a question that I have been asking to myself for a long time now: can a game do everything in its power to be good yet have a concept or other minor detail so stupid that all the effort in the world couldn't possibly redeem it? And if so, what would be an example of this?


E.T. The Extra-Terrestrial (Atari 2600)

If I made a check list of things an Atari 2600 game needed to do to be above par this game would hit all of 'em. Multicolored, recognizable sprites? Check. An adventure game? Check. A title screen? Check. A story? Check.

The game was ruined by overly-complex controls, and poor screen layouts. :/

BlasteroidAli
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Re: Can a game suck no matter how technically well-made it is?

Postby BlasteroidAli » February 11th, 2017, 8:14 pm

pacman000 wrote:
Still, the replies I got on that post strongly disagreed with me, claiming that a darker version simply couldn't work. And this brings me back to a question that I have been asking to myself for a long time now: can a game do everything in its power to be good yet have a concept or other minor detail so stupid that all the effort in the world couldn't possibly redeem it? And if so, what would be an example of this?


E.T. The Extra-Terrestrial (Atari 2600)

If I made a check list of things an Atari 2600 game needed to do to be above par this game would hit all of 'em. Multicolored, recognizable sprites? Check. An adventure game? Check. A title screen? Check. A story? Check.

The game was ruined by overly-complex controls, and poor screen layouts. :/

Where as I loved the game and did not think it has poor screen layouts or controls. Different people think different things. Battle born on the other hand... well..

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VideoGameCritic
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Re: Can a game suck no matter how technically well-made it is?

Postby VideoGameCritic » February 12th, 2017, 11:36 pm

This post reminds me of my recent Earthworm Jim 2 review. There's a level called Lorenzen's Soil (or something like that) which involves digging through an underground maze. Technically the digging effect is very original and quite well executed. Unfortunately it's just not that fun. I've seen a lot of games like that. Mirror's Edge, Limbo, Mad World... these are really innovative games that just aren't very fun to play. On the other hand I've seen games that are technically deficient (Titanfall 2) but still a heck of a lot of fun.

rockofhysteria
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Re: Can a game suck no matter how technically well-made it is?

Postby rockofhysteria » February 13th, 2017, 2:26 am

Based on the last several years of Madden clearly the answer is yes lol

CharlieR
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Re: Can a game suck no matter how technically well-made it is?

Postby CharlieR » February 13th, 2017, 8:29 am

There's a recent game out there for ps4. I'm pretty sure it falls under this category and might push the limits of the system. The game is No Man's Sky, a blockbuster title that I believe quickly became a budget title.

My cousins were excited for it and got it when it first came out, but when I asked them about it a few months ago, they said it was basically a taxonomy simulator.

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Hardcore Sadism
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Re: Can a game suck no matter how technically well-made it is?

Postby Hardcore Sadism » February 13th, 2017, 12:37 pm

Grand Theft Auto IV was recently added to Backwards Compatibility, but I recently got on my dad's Xbox 360 because mine died, and tried to get back into GTA V.

We all can agree that aspects of the fourth game hadn't aged well, but in all honesty I cannot get back into Grand Theft Auto V. It's three character system is bloated and doesn't offer much appeal after you finished the story, just gets so tedious after a few years. The Online community is worse than teenage sonic fans getting into Counter Strike GO, and I would not save them during a flood.

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DaHeckIzDat
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Re: Can a game suck no matter how technically well-made it is?

Postby DaHeckIzDat » February 13th, 2017, 4:26 pm

CharlieR wrote:There's a recent game out there for ps4. I'm pretty sure it falls under this category and might push the limits of the system. The game is No Man's Sky, a blockbuster title that I believe quickly became a budget title.


I wouldn't even say NMS is technically well made. It's scope is enormous, sure, but once you start playing it you'll encounter tons of bugs and glitches, counter productive game design, and just boring, shoddy gameplay overall. This is coming from someone who hasn't played it personally, but I've read and watched enough reviews to know it's the truth.


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