Why the Jaguar version of Doom doesn't have music.

[VideoGameCritic]

One thing that bummed me out about the mid-90s was how there was tremendous pressure to make everything 3D using polygons. The system of the time could have run some truly fantastic 2D games, but their development was stifled.

In fact, it really wasn't until about 10 years ago when game companies began to warm up to the idea that 2D games are a lot of fun, and both can co-exist.

[ThePixelatedGenocide]

[Those are 3d games though.

Only the flat playfields. Everything important is competing for the worst pre-rendered sprite ever made.

[jon]

One thing that bummed me out about the mid-90s was how there was tremendous pressure to make everything 3D using polygons. The system of the time could have run some truly fantastic 2D games, but their development was stifled.

In fact, it really wasn't until about 10 years ago when game companies began to warm up to the idea that 2D games are a lot of fun, and both can co-exist.

I felt like in the mid-90’s they in effect skipped a generation of just getting used to 3d while still having A+ quality. I remember in 2002 just being literally starved for anything 2d again. And Super Mario Sunshine had these mini levels that weren’t quite 2d but brought back those memories. I always felt like it’d sell well too and of course the Wii 2d Mario game flew off the shelves. I have to admit though that in 1994 or so I was very much looking forward to 3d so I’m not faultless.

As far as Pixelated, I don’t know what the Jag was capable of. While on the one hand 2d games like Zool 2 and Super Burnout go at a manic pace, probably using that 68k blast processor, Trevor McFur had no music and I may be wrong but I think the Native demo didn’t have enough room for music. It’s probably best left not having huge what ifs. I’m not one of those maniacs who think the Jag could’ve had 3d games with frame rates rivaling the PS1. And I’m not even sure it could’ve done a 2d Shmup with music as referenced above. I do however think they could’ve improved on games like I-War and Battlemorph. And I’m leaning towards the Jag being able to handle a 2d Shmup with music.

This gets to my final point which is, I don’t think a 3d game needs to have a fast frame rate to be great. Whatever they were doing as far as frame rates for their 3d games, it was enough to be good games. The Jag just didn’t get another couple years to hone in on things and make better games while perhaps increasing frame rates a little. But I never felt like how fast a 3d game is means it’s automatically better.

[ThePixelatedGenocide]

[As far as Pixelated, I don’t know what the Jag was capable of. While on the one hand 2d games like Zool 2 and Super Burnout go at a manic pace, probably using that 68k blast processor, Trevor McFur had no music and I may be wrong but I think the Native demo didn’t have enough room for music. It’s probably best left not having huge what ifs. I’m not one of those maniacs who think the Jag could’ve had 3d games with frame rates rivaling the PS1. And I’m not even sure it could’ve done a 2d Shmup with music as referenced above.

You mean like Raiden? Defender 2000?

Besides.

My first post in this thread linked to a version of Jaguar Doom that's got music running. Go check it out, and be amazed at how bad Atari screwed themselves over.

As for the Jaguar's full power? Apparently, that's a war zone - you need to be a world class coder to even think about trying, and it'll still be a sadomasochistic nightmare to accomplish things that would have been easy anywhere else. The only positive everyone agrees on, is that the Jaguar handles smooth color transitions better than any other console that generation.

Both in 2d and in textures.

It's why Blue Lightning and White Men Can't Jump were able to ruin their sprites. Just because you can smear all the darkest colors together, doesn't mean you should. That feature's also probably the only reason Trevor McFur exists.

No wonder why they call the tech CRY.

[jon]

[As far as Pixelated, I don’t know what the Jag was capable of. While on the one hand 2d games like Zool 2 and Super Burnout go at a manic pace, probably using that 68k blast processor, Trevor McFur had no music and I may be wrong but I think the Native demo didn’t have enough room for music. It’s probably best left not having huge what ifs. I’m not one of those maniacs who think the Jag could’ve had 3d games with frame rates rivaling the PS1. And I’m not even sure it could’ve done a 2d Shmup with music as referenced above.

You mean like Raiden? Defender 2000?

Besides.

My first post in this thread linked to a version of Jaguar Doom that's got music running. Go check it out, and be amazed at how bad Atari screwed themselves over.

As for the Jaguar's full power? Apparently, that's a war zone - you need to be a world class coder to even think about trying, and it'll still be a sadomasochistic nightmare to accomplish things that would have been easy anywhere else. The only positive everyone agrees on, is that the Jaguar handles smooth color transitions better than any other console that generation.

Both in 2d and in textures.

It's why Blue Lightning and White Men Can't Jump were able to ruin their sprites. Just because you can smear all the darkest colors together, doesn't mean you should. That feature's also probably the only reason Trevor McFur exists.

No wonder why they call the tech CRY.

You're right about Raiden and Defender 2000. Maybe Atari should've focused on making a handful of epic fast paced 2d games at the beginning of the Jaguar's lifespan. Now the question is whether it could've handled something like their own original games that could compare to something like Metal Slug or a powered up Contra. I think Zool 2 proves that it could've maybe pulled stuff like that off. I agree that Atari couldn't get out of their own way. There were so many different ways they could've approached the Jaguar's launch and first year or so.

[RDReynolds]

They needed to clone Jeff Minter.

More games like Tempest 2000 early in its life would have helped a lot as it was a barren wasteland forever. It took so long for other games to arrive and when they did they were generally not good. There are a lot of games I love on the Jag (Defender 2000 near the top, I know it’s an acquired taste but I still play it to this day long after beating it), but they just did not arrive early enough to make an impact.

Developers didn’t seem to know what games would work best on the Jag. They tried the same CyberMorph/Hover Strike stuff repeatedly which never really worked and made the system seem woefully underpowered. Not sure it would have mattered with the PlayStation on the horizon; Sony was too big and understood the market far beyond what anyone else did, especially Atari at that time.

[BanjoPickles]

I’ve been playing Atari 50 Collection this week, and I’ve been enjoying the small selection of Jaguar games available. I’ve honestly been wanting to play Tempest 2000 for nearly thirty years, so this collection is a godsend….and the game didn’t disappoint. It’s amazing!

That being said, I see games that had potential, but needed more time in the oven. Fight For Life wasn’t as terrible as I was expecting, but it had enough problems that kept it from being a good game. Same with Cybermorph. Atari Karts could have benefited from having a battle mode, more power ups, and more interesting tracks. For the most part, I see games with cut corners, that had the potential to really be something.

And I thought the Doom music issue had something to do with the rights.

[RDReynolds]

I’ve been playing Atari 50 Collection this week, and I’ve been enjoying the small selection of Jaguar games available. I’ve honestly been wanting to play Tempest 2000 for nearly thirty years, so this collection is a godsend….and the game didn’t disappoint. It’s amazing!

I've been playing Atari 50 this week as well, and am quite impressed with how closely they got Tempest 2000 to the original Jaguar version. I feel like I can speak of this as a good authority, as I think I've owned every version of T2K ever released - Saturn, Mac, PC, Tempest X3 on the PS1, Tempest 3000 Nuon, Tempest 4000, TxK, Space Giraffe, whatever else. Outside of maybe the Saturn version (which has the music from the CD release, not the Jag music), I'd say this is the closest to the original. There are a few small glitches here and there (stuff only someone who has played it for 30 years would notice!), but I am thrilled to be able to play this on the Switch. They did a good job for sure.