darkrage6 -
I am hearing a lot of apologists imploring us to withhold judgement until E3. What could Microsoft possibly have to show that's going to sway public opinion? They've been designing the system for years, and now they're going to shift gears in 2 weeks? No, they've made their bed and they have to sleep in it. They deserve failure and their failure is going to be monumental.
VGC
New Xbox: Xbox One
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Rev1
- Posts: 1777
- Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm
New Xbox: Xbox One
[QUOTE=darkrage6]Yeah, and besides ME was only a minor misstep, everyone quickly forgot about it. Vista was a bigger flop since they hyped it up so much and it turned out to be letdown in most aspects, fortunately Windows 7 improved most of the problems. I think it's foolish to assume Sony and Nintendo have this generation to themselves, the fact that Nintendo scaled back their press conference this year dosen't exactly bode well for them, I believe MS will have a strong showing at E3 and silence the haters.[/QUOTE]
yeah but for most people the choice between Vista was pretty much mandatory since for most computer users they will either use the Window's that was defaulted on the computer or pick up a Mac. That's it. Most computer users (when I say most, I'm referring to 95% of people, not the computer savvy) ended up with Vista because they needed a new computer and surprise, your local retailer only had the choice between the two. Would you go with the Mac, which is a bit different then a PC? or go with whatever else is on the retail floor which is sort of familiar to your last computer. Vista was pretty much a mandatory upgrade to most consumers who didn't want to bother with learning how to use a MAC and that is a bad comparison... You get 2 other consoles plus a PC to choose from if you want to game, or you can just not upgrade until much later in the console's life cycle once any potential flops are destroyed. You aren't required to have a console to connect to facebook, check your email, browse the internet, play Solitaire, or whatever your many reasons to own a console. You just pass on the games and pick up a different product, console or not... And of course, this is going from a early 2000's perspective...
yeah but for most people the choice between Vista was pretty much mandatory since for most computer users they will either use the Window's that was defaulted on the computer or pick up a Mac. That's it. Most computer users (when I say most, I'm referring to 95% of people, not the computer savvy) ended up with Vista because they needed a new computer and surprise, your local retailer only had the choice between the two. Would you go with the Mac, which is a bit different then a PC? or go with whatever else is on the retail floor which is sort of familiar to your last computer. Vista was pretty much a mandatory upgrade to most consumers who didn't want to bother with learning how to use a MAC and that is a bad comparison... You get 2 other consoles plus a PC to choose from if you want to game, or you can just not upgrade until much later in the console's life cycle once any potential flops are destroyed. You aren't required to have a console to connect to facebook, check your email, browse the internet, play Solitaire, or whatever your many reasons to own a console. You just pass on the games and pick up a different product, console or not... And of course, this is going from a early 2000's perspective...
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NewModelArmy1
- Posts: 100
- Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm
New Xbox: Xbox One
[QUOTE=videogamecritic]darkrage6 -
I am hearing a lot of apologists imploring us to withhold judgement until E3. What could Microsoft possibly have to show that's going to sway public opinion? They've been designing the system for years, and now they're going to shift gears in 2 weeks? No, they've made their bed and they have to sleep in it. They deserve failure and their failure is going to be monumental.
VGC[/QUOTE]
Are you serious with this? LOL!
I am hearing a lot of apologists imploring us to withhold judgement until E3. What could Microsoft possibly have to show that's going to sway public opinion? They've been designing the system for years, and now they're going to shift gears in 2 weeks? No, they've made their bed and they have to sleep in it. They deserve failure and their failure is going to be monumental.
VGC[/QUOTE]
Are you serious with this? LOL!
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darkrage61
- Posts: 1678
- Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm
New Xbox: Xbox One
Failure monumental? Yeah you wish! LOL Just because someone is interested in the system dosen't auotmatically make them an "apologist" that's just nonsense. I think E3 WILL change things, so we'll wait and see.
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weallmissedme1
- Posts: 397
- Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm
New Xbox: Xbox One
Looks like the brand loyalists are hard at work.......defending the inevitable. It's heartbreaking because Microsoft had such a future ahead of them in gaming, now they're just gonna hit the brick wall and die like Atari did......*sigh*.
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a1
- Posts: 3032
- Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm
New Xbox: Xbox One
[QUOTE=videogamecritic]darkrage6 -
I am hearing a lot of apologists imploring us to withhold judgement until E3. What could Microsoft possibly have to show that's going to sway public opinion? They've been designing the system for years, and now they're going to shift gears in 2 weeks? No, they've made their bed and they have to sleep in it. They deserve failure and their failure is going to be monumental.
VGC[/QUOTE]
I don't disagree with your opinion, but I'm worried that we're being too optimistic. I mentioned this on another thread about the Xbox One (we certainly have a lot going), but these policies might not matter to many consumers. They certainly matter to most of us on this site, because we collect games; that's what this site is about. But do they matter to the majority of gamers? Do they matter to enough gamers to make the console fail?
We can only hope.
I am hearing a lot of apologists imploring us to withhold judgement until E3. What could Microsoft possibly have to show that's going to sway public opinion? They've been designing the system for years, and now they're going to shift gears in 2 weeks? No, they've made their bed and they have to sleep in it. They deserve failure and their failure is going to be monumental.
VGC[/QUOTE]
I don't disagree with your opinion, but I'm worried that we're being too optimistic. I mentioned this on another thread about the Xbox One (we certainly have a lot going), but these policies might not matter to many consumers. They certainly matter to most of us on this site, because we collect games; that's what this site is about. But do they matter to the majority of gamers? Do they matter to enough gamers to make the console fail?
We can only hope.
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weallmissedme1
- Posts: 397
- Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm
New Xbox: Xbox One
a, you seem to be forgetting the used game market. What about GameFly? Alot of people use that. And people wouldn't want to pay and activation fee every time they rented a game from them. It is a bad idea. They've alienated most of their fanbase. Only die hards defend it, and there are few die hards willing to look past these flaws as it is. What an awful idea. Sony and Nintendo will be the dominant players in the market. Nintendo Wii U is already out as it is. Will Sony be number one again, or will Nintendo get the software line going this E3 and capitalize on the success of the Wii? The excitement of it is awesome. We'll see............but I'm convinced Microsoft won't even sell 100,000 in the first day.
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ActRaiser1
- Posts: 2726
- Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm
New Xbox: Xbox One
[QUOTE=weallmissedme]a, you seem to be forgetting the used game market. What about GameFly? Alot of people use that. And people wouldn't want to pay and activation fee every time they rented a game from them. It is a bad idea. They've alienated most of their fanbase. Only die hards defend it, and there are few die hards willing to look past these flaws as it is. What an awful idea. Sony and Nintendo will be the dominant players in the market. Nintendo Wii U is already out as it is. Will Sony be number one again, or will Nintendo get the software line going this E3 and capitalize on the success of the Wii? The excitement of it is awesome. We'll see............but I'm convinced Microsoft won't even sell 100,000 in the first day.[/QUOTE]
You can configure DRM with a time component. Once the time duration ends the program is locked. Conceivably Microsoft could provide Gamefly a method for generating a 1 month code, for example (or 3 month).
Likewise, you can generate a trial code that contains an X day unlock code. I say this as I used to work for Digital River. Similarly, Microsoft is a Digital River customer. The technology is/has been widely available and used in the PC software industry for a number of years. I have no idea if Microsoft is using any of the standard off the shelf DRM tools available by Digital River or they're using their own in house solutions. Either way, this stuff has been available for a while and works.
You can configure DRM with a time component. Once the time duration ends the program is locked. Conceivably Microsoft could provide Gamefly a method for generating a 1 month code, for example (or 3 month).
Likewise, you can generate a trial code that contains an X day unlock code. I say this as I used to work for Digital River. Similarly, Microsoft is a Digital River customer. The technology is/has been widely available and used in the PC software industry for a number of years. I have no idea if Microsoft is using any of the standard off the shelf DRM tools available by Digital River or they're using their own in house solutions. Either way, this stuff has been available for a while and works.
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a1
- Posts: 3032
- Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm
New Xbox: Xbox One
[QUOTE=weallmissedme]a, you seem to be forgetting the used game market. What about GameFly? Alot of people use that. And people wouldn't want to pay and activation fee every time they rented a game from them. It is a bad idea. They've alienated most of their fanbase. Only die hards defend it, and there are few die hards willing to look past these flaws as it is. What an awful idea. Sony and Nintendo will be the dominant players in the market. Nintendo Wii U is already out as it is. Will Sony be number one again, or will Nintendo get the software line going this E3 and capitalize on the success of the Wii? The excitement of it is awesome. We'll see............but I'm convinced Microsoft won't even sell 100,000 in the first day.[/QUOTE]
I think that many here are forgetting that all of this consumer backlash--like the 75% of people upset about the Xbox One in IGN's poll--is something only coming from gamers who read articles on game websites. I'm just making a guess here, but I'd bet most 360 owners haven't been reading about the Xbox One, or haven't even heard of it yet.
Again, I'm as against it as anyone here, but I'm just less optimistic that it will fail as badly as we want it to.
And Microsoft may have plans for game rentals that they haven't revealed.
I think that many here are forgetting that all of this consumer backlash--like the 75% of people upset about the Xbox One in IGN's poll--is something only coming from gamers who read articles on game websites. I'm just making a guess here, but I'd bet most 360 owners haven't been reading about the Xbox One, or haven't even heard of it yet.
Again, I'm as against it as anyone here, but I'm just less optimistic that it will fail as badly as we want it to.
And Microsoft may have plans for game rentals that they haven't revealed.
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Atarifever1
- Posts: 3892
- Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm
New Xbox: Xbox One
[QUOTE=a]
I think that many here are forgetting that all of this consumer backlash--like the 75% of people upset about the Xbox One in IGN's poll--is something only coming from gamers who read articles on game websites. I'm just making a guess here, but I'd bet most 360 owners haven't been reading about the Xbox One, or haven't even heard of it yet.
Again, I'm as against it as anyone here, but I'm just less optimistic that it will fail as badly as we want it to.
And Microsoft may have plans for game rentals that they haven't revealed.[/QUOTE]
Take heart a! The last time I saw a backlash like this was for the PS3 regarding the price. The apologists there talked up the Blu-Ray player and said the average consumer would buy for that. The average consumer still hasn't given up on DVD in 2013. It took Sony a long time to climb back from that one.
In fact, look at every third console and you see the pattern.
Atari almost couldn't save themselves, but it can be argued at one point they started to care about profits at the expense of the gamer; releasing rushed games to meet deadlines with no care for the actual product.
Sega started obsessing over hardware. Afraid of the SNES, they do the Sega CD. Afraid of losing Genesis players they do the 32X. Wanting to have the best system for the 2D genres popular at the time they made a system hard to program for. With the 32X and Sega CD they essentially passed their paranoia on to the gamer as added cost and a more confusing market.
Nintendo went with carts (which I love) on the N64 largely (and you can argue against it but it is true) to make piracy harder. They were obsessed with piracy even when they went mini DVD over DVD the following gen. With the N64, they passed on their concern over piracy to the gamer, in higher costs per game and more limited sound, video, and cutscenes.
With the PS3 Sony was certain that not the games or the prices of their consoles sold their units, but the CD player in one and the DVD player in the other. That was a little true, especially with the PS2. However, years before Blu-Ray was as needed for games as DVD or CD had been, Sony banked everything on putting a hugely expensive additional component in, not for the games, but to get you to adopt Blu-Ray for them. Look at the 360. It is still putting out all the multiplatform games today and it doesn't have Blu-Ray. How essential was that addition to gaming in 2006? Essential enough to make the sticker shock worth it? Nope. Because unlike the PS2 or PS1, the media format was the focus of the PS3 for Sony, not the games and not the gamer.
If you follow this trend, you'll see that console 3 seems to be "games, but this first..." time for companies. Now look at the Xbox One.
I think that many here are forgetting that all of this consumer backlash--like the 75% of people upset about the Xbox One in IGN's poll--is something only coming from gamers who read articles on game websites. I'm just making a guess here, but I'd bet most 360 owners haven't been reading about the Xbox One, or haven't even heard of it yet.
Again, I'm as against it as anyone here, but I'm just less optimistic that it will fail as badly as we want it to.
And Microsoft may have plans for game rentals that they haven't revealed.[/QUOTE]
Take heart a! The last time I saw a backlash like this was for the PS3 regarding the price. The apologists there talked up the Blu-Ray player and said the average consumer would buy for that. The average consumer still hasn't given up on DVD in 2013. It took Sony a long time to climb back from that one.
In fact, look at every third console and you see the pattern.
Atari almost couldn't save themselves, but it can be argued at one point they started to care about profits at the expense of the gamer; releasing rushed games to meet deadlines with no care for the actual product.
Sega started obsessing over hardware. Afraid of the SNES, they do the Sega CD. Afraid of losing Genesis players they do the 32X. Wanting to have the best system for the 2D genres popular at the time they made a system hard to program for. With the 32X and Sega CD they essentially passed their paranoia on to the gamer as added cost and a more confusing market.
Nintendo went with carts (which I love) on the N64 largely (and you can argue against it but it is true) to make piracy harder. They were obsessed with piracy even when they went mini DVD over DVD the following gen. With the N64, they passed on their concern over piracy to the gamer, in higher costs per game and more limited sound, video, and cutscenes.
With the PS3 Sony was certain that not the games or the prices of their consoles sold their units, but the CD player in one and the DVD player in the other. That was a little true, especially with the PS2. However, years before Blu-Ray was as needed for games as DVD or CD had been, Sony banked everything on putting a hugely expensive additional component in, not for the games, but to get you to adopt Blu-Ray for them. Look at the 360. It is still putting out all the multiplatform games today and it doesn't have Blu-Ray. How essential was that addition to gaming in 2006? Essential enough to make the sticker shock worth it? Nope. Because unlike the PS2 or PS1, the media format was the focus of the PS3 for Sony, not the games and not the gamer.
If you follow this trend, you'll see that console 3 seems to be "games, but this first..." time for companies. Now look at the Xbox One.