360 Live?

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bluemonkey1
Posts: 2444
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

360 Live?

Postby bluemonkey1 » March 14th, 2006, 10:11 pm

Ooh one other point.

 

The wireless connectivity of the 360 for streaming is great.

 

Though the XBox and 360 also allow ethernet cabling connection options.  I thought the DS required you to use wireless.  Personally I will never play games over a wireless connection - the delay is just too high.  Sure there is no noticeable lag visually but it is there.  It is like the difference between a 100ms ping and an 18ms ping in Counter-strike.  You can't detect it visually but it really affects your performance.  The fact is that wireless networks are just really lossy and it will just get worse as they proliferate.  The radius of these things can be pretty high so as more people get them you'll get interference from your neighbours, their neighbours, the guy parked out in your street using your connection if you didn't secure it properly.  Ethernet is the only thing games should be played over if there is the option for it.

 

Of course if the DS allows to play using ethernet cable then I talk it back.  Of course who am I kidding there's no way you'll ever be able to play high precision games like Counter-strike on that screen anyway.


chrisbid1
Posts: 941
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

360 Live?

Postby chrisbid1 » March 14th, 2006, 10:13 pm

online DS play is free, so the two are apples and oranges

bluemonkey1
Posts: 2444
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

360 Live?

Postby bluemonkey1 » March 14th, 2006, 10:30 pm

Not quite.

 

If DS online does only use wireless then you need a higher capacity internet connection for it which costs more.  The £34 quid a year fee for Live pales in comparison to the £15-20 a month cost of broadband.  Ammortised over the year it works out at less than £3 a month on top of a bill of at least £15 for the broadband.  Hardly worth quibbling about.


Leo Ames

360 Live?

Postby Leo Ames » March 14th, 2006, 11:04 pm

Plus with the DS, if you don't have the right wireless router, you get to pay $40 for the wifi adapter.

Not sure why he hates Microsoft so much for, but what we've seen with Xbox Live is what the future of online gaming is in my opinion, not Nintendo's 3 game wifi service with very limited features.


Conn

360 Live?

Postby Conn » March 15th, 2006, 1:09 am

Sign up for Silver. It's free (as in, no monthly fees) and you get to download demos and buy Xbox Live Arcade games. Right now only Geometry Wars (an awesome looking Robotron clone) is worthwhile, unless you want Robotron or Smash TV, but others have been announced.

Atarifever1
Posts: 3892
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

360 Live?

Postby Atarifever1 » March 15th, 2006, 8:11 am

[QUOTE=bluemonkey]

Not quite.

 

If DS online does only use wireless then you need a higher capacity internet connection for it which costs more.  The �34 quid a year fee for Live pales in comparison to the �15-20 a month cost of broadband.  Ammortised over the year it works out at less than �3 a month on top of a bill of at least �15 for the broadband.  Hardly worth quibbling about.

[/QUOTE]
I'm on the apples and oranges side of this debate, and I think Live is better than the current DS online, but come on, that arguement is silly.  If we're talking price differences here how about the price difference between a DS or a 360 (and let's remember that's what this topic is about).  Let's "ammortise" that difference in there.  Let's see $300 (before taxes, I'm being a little nice to the 360 here) Canadian divided by 12 equals, oh, $25 extra a month.  Wow, that's a lot.  Now, let's think about the price difference in each game.  According to EB Canada the starting price of the 360 games is $59.99, while for the DS it is $34.99.  Wow, so if you buy two games to play online you also have to pay $50 more to play xbox live.  Now, lets add in the fact that, on average, not every person playing a DS doesn't already have a good internet connection (I certainly do, what are you guys on? dial-up?) easily capable of handling the "epic" expectations of the DS and the average difference for John Q. Gamer is much much much higher to get the 360 online.    Stop being silly about it and just argue that the 360 has a much more robust service that will remain the best in the industry for at least the rest of this generation. 

bluemonkey1
Posts: 2444
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

360 Live?

Postby bluemonkey1 » March 15th, 2006, 1:40 pm

No the discussion is about the cost of the Live service not the cost of the consoles.


bluemonkey1
Posts: 2444
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

360 Live?

Postby bluemonkey1 » March 15th, 2006, 3:36 pm

Also Atarifever if you had bothered to read the posts you would know that I was talking about the Live service on XBox not the 360 as SSX was targetting the XBox not the 360.

 

Here in the UK the standard is 128-256kbps broadband.  As a computer scientist let me assure you there is no network more lossy than wireless.  It's not great.  Games like Counter-strike require realisticly pings of around 30ms consistently to play competitively.  I seriously doubt that is possible on a wireless connection given the number of packets that get dumped and the slow transmission rate of the medium itself.  My point is that lag isn't really a concern with games like Mario Kart but for precision shooters like Counter-strike well, I don't know any PC gamers who play it over wireless put it that way.

 

Ethernet cable will always provide better gameplay.


Atarifever1
Posts: 3892
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 7:00 pm

360 Live?

Postby Atarifever1 » March 15th, 2006, 5:31 pm

[QUOTE=bluemonkey]

No the discussion is about the cost of the Live service not the cost of the consoles.

[/QUOTE]
No, you weren't.  You were talking about stuff like having to change your internet service (and your pal there was talking about buying new routers or some other silliness).   If we are talking about the price of live then the only thing you can do is compare "free" to "costs money", which is the apples  and oranges thing.  If I can't bring the cost of consoles into the equation then surely you must see how discussing which type of connection you have is extraneous.  Everyone has to buy the console to play Live or Nintendo online, a large portion of the market already has the internet connection that is required anyway. If anything your arguement is the one that has to be dropped.  Also, your whole logic is that people will get that connection solely for the DS and that that has to be considered in just the cost of playing the DS, which completely ignores the fact that the connection allows for the internet connection they wanted in the first place.  That's as illogical as saying that because I like Futurama my whole cable bill goes towards paying for it, so I'd be better off just buying the DVDs and cancelling my cable.  A better internet connection offers more than online DS play.  Don't even get me started on how if you average it out all of your figures are way too high ( every person who already has a good wireless conection pays $0 for online DS play, average them in with the people who only need the USB key and thus over the whole DS lifespan will pay $35 once instead of a live fee every year, and your average cost per gamer is going to be much lower than your estimates.  Meanwhile every live player pays as much as it costs to play Live so their average is exacly what you said.  Opps, I got started).
[QUOTE]Also Atarifever if you had bothered to read the posts you would know that I was talking about the Live service on XBox not the 360 as SSX was targetting the XBox not the 360.[/QUOTE]
SSX said "Xbox or that horrible 360" and the topic is about the 360, where did you get that this was mainly about the original xbox?  Even your post I responded too doesn't say that.  Maybe you should read it.  I mean for goodness sake you even make a statement earlier about streaming to the 360 and also about online only improving on the 360.  Look at your second response after SSx's comment and tell me where you didn't move on to the 360.  I guess my problem is that I read your posts.  Next time I'll try reading your mind.

Leo Ames

360 Live?

Postby Leo Ames » March 15th, 2006, 7:35 pm

"and your pal there was talking about buying new routers or some other silliness"

 

If that's in referance to my post for some reason, it's hardly silliness. Oh and if you were referring to my post, I don't know him and I'm not his buddy, and I have a name to be referred to as.

 

Unless your wireless router is one of the one's Nintendo has choosen to be compatible with their service, you either have to purchase a new wireless router, or buy the Nintendo Wi-Fi USB Connector from Nintendo online for $35 before taxes and shipping and handling.

 

If Nintendo was as gracious as you make it out to be, they'd of put a USB port on the DS and allow people to use a 2 dollar USB cable to connect the DS to their PC if they don't have a wireless solution. Instead, it cost me $40 just to be able to go online with Mario Kart and discover all the 12 year olds with no lifes that have learned how to power slide through entire courses.

 

Hoping some other company will take advantage of the service and make my investment worthwhile, but it looks to be about as useful as the Game Cube's broadband adapter was unless there's a lot of surprises announced at E3...

 

As you can see I'm not happy with the state of things. First my brand new wireless router bought right before MK launched isn't supported. So I get to shell out 40 bucks to Nintendo for the wifi adapter, only to discover I hate snaking, and realize multiplayer MK doesn't do much for me when only 1/4 of the courses are available online, and especially has no online battle mode. lol

 

In Nintendo's defense though, it's my fault, I knew my wireless router may not be compatible, and I was aware of the online modes and selection of tracks before putting my cash down for MKDS. Thankfully it's still a solid game.



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