Challenge

[Vexer1]

I personally don't think stuff like Dear Esther should be sold on Steam though, it's very misleading to put it under the "Adventure" category when it really dosen't fit the genre at all.

[ptdebate1]

[QUOTE=Vexer]I personally don't think stuff like Dear Esther should be sold on Steam though, it's very misleading to put it under the "Adventure" category when it really dosen't fit the genre at all.[/QUOTE]

Steam sell plenty of non-games though--such as music production software, video capture software, game creation software... Why should they snub Dear Esther just because it doesn't meet all of the community's bullet points of a "game" (HUD, objectives, guns, pointy things, thirty-something white male protagonists)?

[pacguy191]

[QUOTE=ptdebate]Steam sell plenty of non-games though--such as music production software, video capture software, game creation software... Why should they snub Dear Esther just because it doesn't meet all of the community's bullet points of a "game" (HUD, objectives, guns, pointy things, thirty-something white male protagonists)?[/QUOTE]
Ignoring the "30-something white male protagonist" comment, should Steam be selling things that aren't games? Dear Esther is interactive fiction, not a game, but the two are related, so I can see why that's on there.

General software shouldn't be sold on Steam though. It's a gaming platform, not an app store. Windows and Mac both have app stores - do we really need another?

[Vexer1]

I didn't even know Steam sold stuff like video capture software, still though you have to admit listing a title like Dear Esther under "Adventure" is at best very misleading.

Totalbiscuit sums it up much better then me in his WTF video of the game.

[pacguy191]

[QUOTE=Vexer]I didn't even know Steam sold stuff like video capture software, still though you have to admit listing a title like Dear Esther under "Adventure" is at best very misleading.[/QUOTE]
What is an adventure? Undertaking a large journey to uncover or retrieve something, right? That's the classic definition. That's exactly what Dear Esther is. You're navigating an empty island to uncover a story about what happened to this Esther character.

Just because it's uniquely put forth doesn't mean it isn't an adventure.

Also, what does this have to do with challenge?

[Vexer1]

When most people think of adventure games, they think of something like Secret Of Monkey Island or Broken Sword, not something where all you do is hold down the W key the entire time, there's nothing "adventurous" about that at all if you ask me.

It has to do with challenge, because in something like Dear Esther, the challenge is in how tedious it is to get through the experience, and that's not a challenge I enjoy.

[ptdebate1]

[QUOTE=Vexer]

When most people think of adventure games, they think of something like Secret Of Monkey Island or Broken Sword, not something where all you do is hold down the W key the entire time, there's nothing "adventurous" about that at all if you ask me.

It has to do with challenge, because in something like Dear Esther, the challenge is in how tedious it is to get through the experience, and that's not a challenge I enjoy.

[/QUOTE]

Dear Ester is tedious when all you have to do is experience the story? Do you find movies tedious too?

[pacguy191]

[QUOTE=Vexer]When most people think of adventure games, they think of something like Secret Of Monkey Island or Broken Sword, not something where all you do is hold down the W key the entire time, there's nothing "adventurous" about that at all if you ask me.[/QUOTE]
Oversimplification of the century.

So is Counter-Strike no longer about strategy? It's just about holding W and shooting, right?

So is Civilization no longer about planning? It's just about dragging stuff around, right?

So is Mario no longer about platforming? It's just about holding right on the controller, right?

Maybe you just haven't thought that far. Maybe Totalbiscuit can help you out with that one too.

[velcrozombie1]

[QUOTE=Vexer]

When most people think of adventure games, they think of something like Secret Of Monkey Island or Broken Sword, not something where all you do is hold down the W key the entire time, there's nothing "adventurous" about that at all if you ask me.

It has to do with challenge, because in something like Dear Esther, the challenge is in how tedious it is to get through the experience, and that's not a challenge I enjoy.

[/QUOTE]

I often see games like Secret of Monkey Island referred to as "point-and-click adventure" or simply "point-and-click" to avoid confusion. I've seen the "adventure" tag (or sometimes "action-adventure") slapped on games like the Zelda series or the recent Batman: Arkham games, probably to distinguish them from purer action games since they have elements of non-linear exploration, puzzle-solving and item collection involved. It's a thin line sometimes, though.

I can't comment on Dear Esther,  although I've seen it derisively called a "walking simulator". I guess it has some element of exploration (or at least the idea of "being taken for a ride") and a lack of conflict that make it easier to label as an adventure game than anything else. I don't really care if it's even a game in a traditional sense - I just used that term because I cringe when I type "interactive storytelling experience", a term I've seen used for some of David Cage's games.

[Vexer1]

ptdebate- Your question makes no sense whatsoever, Dear Esther's story(if you can even call it that) was simply not compelling at all for me, it has nothing do with movies at all, i'd be fine with the lack of interactivity if the narrative.

Pacguy19- Don't really see how that's "oversimplification" at all as there's no interactivity whatsoever to speak of,  none of your examples make any sense whatsoever.  I have "thought that far", if you disagree that's fine, but if you can't accept my opinion, then that's your problem, not mine.