Ethics in videogames

[ActRaiser1]

There's been a couple of threads so far about "stealing" and "morality" when it comes to emulating a game.  So, let's open it up to discussion.

 

1.  First off, is it stealing or wrong to play an emulated game when you own a copy of said game?

 

[my take it's not stealing/wrong due to the fair use standard taken by the recording industry, meaning I can play my music however I want it whether on my PC or on a tape deck after making a copy of it.]

 

2.  Is it stealing or wrong to play an emulated game when it's no longer available in either the first or secondary market?  For example of a non existent secondary market think of a really old obscure arcade game that the developer/publisher no longer exists and there's no current property rights holder for.

 

[nothing wrong with this either as no one actually owns it, eventually the intellectual property rights will place this into the public domain anyway, why not get it sooner rather than later]

 

3.  Is it stealing or wrong to play an emulated game that's available on the secondary market only?

 

[You can purchase it off of ebay; however, you're paying through the nose especially on those rare titles.  As the developer/publisher doesn't receive any revenue at all for titles purchased on the secondary market who are you stealing from?  Toss a coin on this one but for me it's not theft until the videogame industry comes up with a revenue sharing plan similar to the MPAA and RIAA]

 

4.  Is it stealing or wrong to play an emulated game that's available in the primary market?

 

[Yes, absolutely, no questions ands or butts on this one]

 

What's everyone elses take on this?  [minus Crevelle and Mozart who seem to only poop rainbows]

 

and just so i'm completely unbiased on this issue as I can't stand to play emulated games on my PC, though the links to actual usb controllers are really appealing.

[chrisbid1]

i pretty much agree, emulation is essential in keeping neglected games of the past alive. even companies that republish a majority of the back catalogues leave stuff out (ie Vs Super Mario Bros from the arcade by Nintendo). i dont agree with playing ROMS that are readily available on modern platforms, but copyright holders probably thought their old work was junk until the emulation scene came along back in the 90s anyway.

[Conn]

I agree with you on all of those, ActRaiser. However, I definitely prefer owning a physical copy, so I'll try to get one if possible, and if I'm not paying tons.

[VideoGameCritic]

It's interesting, for months I've been saying how hawking Wii's and PS3'son ebay is ethically wrong, but legal.  In the case of emulation, it's the other way around.  It may not be technically legal to use some emulators, but if the game is not available at a reasonable price, I see nothing wrong with it ethically. 

I think the gaming industry can address this problem easily by putting out reasonable priced compilations of old console and arcade games, like Capcom and Sega have done recently.  If companies don't want to make the effort, I see nothing wrong with running emulated versions of those games.

[sega saturn x]

Emulation is great when were talking ten+ year old games, but if you're steal rainbow six vega that's not cool.

[Edward M]

[QUOTE=ActRaiser]

There's been a couple of threads so far about "stealing" and "morality" when it comes to emulating a game.  So, let's open it up to discussion.

 

1.  First off, is it stealing or wrong to play an emulated game when you own a copy of said game?

 

[my take it's not stealing/wrong due to the fair use standard taken by the recording industry, meaning I can play my music however I want it whether on my PC or on a tape deck after making a copy of it.]

 

No its not.   And copyright laws in this country are complete garbage.  The fact that can be force to pay over $100,000 to pirate a game you own (But thank God no judge has actually enforced the copyright laws though.) 

 

2.  Is it stealing or wrong to play an emulated game when it's no longer available in either the first or secondary market?  For example of a non existent secondary market think of a really old obscure arcade game that the developer/publisher no longer exists and there's no current property rights holder for.

 

[nothing wrong with this either as no one actually owns it, eventually the intellectual property rights will place this into the public domain anyway, why not get it sooner rather than later]

 

Nothing wrong with this.  There are many abandonware sites out there to get great games.  If someone is such a "person of high moral values" to not download some great abandoned games, they are missing out.  

 

 

3.  Is it stealing or wrong to play an emulated game that's available on the secondary market only?

 

[You can purchase it off of ebay; however, you're paying through the nose especially on those rare titles.  As the developer/publisher doesn't receive any revenue at all for titles purchased on the secondary market who are you stealing from?  Toss a coin on this one but for me it's not theft until the videogame industry comes up with a revenue sharing plan similar to the MPAA and RIAA]

Do I really want to pay some second hand store 70 dollars to play EVO for SNES, when I can download it for free?   No, i'll live with my moral shortcomings and play it for free.  Hey, I don't even make 70 dollars in one day!

 

 

4.  Is it stealing or wrong to play an emulated game that's available in the primary market?

 

[Yes, absolutely, no questions ands or butts on this one]

 

It depends.  All humans are greedy and immoral by nature.  There are far worse things you can do than this, such as actually stealing something (aka depriving people of property).  Most people have done far worse things than pirating a game.  All a game is, is a copy of a idea.   By pirating a game, I am not taking anything away from someone else.  I want to play far more games than I could ever afford, so I see nothing wrong with pirating in my case, because I buy a ton of games anyway.  I'm sure there are some moral absolutists who may see a problem with this, but I really don't care.   I can live with being called a "thief"   but I get to play all the games I want without having to eat Ramen noodles.

[/QUOTE]

[Shawn]

Wow so the VGC believes it is ok to steal but not ok to buy something and sell it legally. Stick to videogames....people like you are disturbing.

[m0zart1]

[QUOTE=ActRaiser]What's everyone elses take on this?  [minus Crevelle and Mozart who seem to only poop rainbows][/QUOTE]

 

Ha!  And that's an insult?  It almost makes me feel good about myself.

 

I'm giving my opinion anyway.  Without going into your 4-part situational questionaire, I think it's wrong in any situation where the game has not been put into the public domain, and you don't own the game in the same format it was released on. (i.e. owning a license to play an XBOX binary of SH2 isn't the same as owning a license to play a PS2 binary of SH2).  I am not talking legalities here, but straight ethics -- it is morally wrong to play a game that you don't own (outside of a few allowable instances like multiplayer at a friend's house) or that isn't in the public domain.

 

I disagree with the critic.  I put intellectual property ethically on the same level as any other type of physical property.  In fact, the case can easily be made that physical property derives its value from the intellectual work done on said physical items to begin with, or in other words, all property, physical or otherwise, derives its essential characteristics from intellectual property.  You are definitely taking something from someone when you use their intellectual property against their will -- you are taking away the work of their mind without their consent.

 

Like any property, IP doesn't become publically owned just because a trader refuses to trade.  It remains property essentially, and use of it without license of the owner is immoral/unethical.  Even when legalities arise to make it legal to do so, the ethical underpinnings remain the same.

[Paul Campbell]

[QUOTE=Shawn]

Wow so the VGC believes it is ok to steal but not ok to buy something and sell it legally. Stick to videogames....people like you are disturbing.

[/QUOTE]

....said Shawn, who methodically makes disturbing posts this forum.


       That is a typical response from you Shawn, putting words or ideas out there that the person niether said nor implied, so I will try to fix your crap.

     Dave obviously (obvious to us normal people, anyway) said he doesn't feel it is stealing to download and play something that is no longer available for retail sale from the original manufacturer.  I have a Commodore emulator on my Computer with plenty of software that is no longer available to the public.  I am not taking money from the developers pocket, and i am not taking it directly from them, so how is it stealing??   On the other hand, if you download a game that is currently on the market first-hand, you are taking money from the developer, and it is therefore dishonest.  Don't be stupid and jump out there with sharp, rude statements without checking what you are saying first.  What you said was factually wrong, yet you still maligned the person for it.  People like you disturb me.

[chrisbid1]

it was only recently when the definition of piracy was changed to include these types of situations. before, piracy implied people [I]profited[/I] from an intellectual property that did not belong to them.

it amazes me how self righteous people get about this topic. its as if you take the word of corporations (who got the laws and definition changed) as absolute. lighten up. morality stems from the real world harm your actions cause, and being a dick about this trumped up rule is far more immoral than breaking it.